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Wesley

You're a sell-out, maaaaaaaaaaaaan....

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SO.

 

I was reading about the stupid bullshit behind this advert using the Smiths' song (well, a cover).

 

I was surprised to hear that a dog's head was in the box, but still, this isn't the point of this thread.

 

This is the video I'm talking about:

 

 

From anyone outside of the UK (no idea if this store exists outside of the UK), John Lewis is an over-priced department store that one day will go out of business.

 

ANYWAY!

 

The point of this thread was that loads of morons are claiming that "The Smiths" have sold-out for letting them use "their" song.

 

Apparently John Lewis had to ask the record label and Morrissey (for those who don't know anything about The Smiths, Morrissey is a man who loves flowers and also happened to be the voice and lyrics behind the music) for permission, which both gave.

 

AS SUCH!

 

People have then labelled them as selling out, especially because the song in question originally dealt with themes of a non-materialist nature suddenly being used to sell crap you don't need.

 

SO WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THIS AND OTHER CASES OF PEOPLE "SELLING OUT"?!

 

I'm shouting so people definitely know what I'm talking about.

 

I THINK.

 

UMMM...

 

Well I'm in two minds about it.

 

At first I feel it's all bullshit and everyone sells themselves.

 

But then when I hear about people refusing certain things, like Coldplay having refused Coca-Cola from using one of their songs, I have an odd respect for that.

 

And when I was in the US (they let me in even though I've killed a man) I saw Ellen Page in an advertisement for Cisco (I think).

 

Basically she walked into a classroom and saw all these little kids being taught by a teacher miiiiles away.

 

In another she's in a hospital (probably after having that baby in that documentary, Juno) and sees that some git is being treated by a doctor who is also miiiiiles away.

 

I presume they both were in fact miiiiiles away, and not just in the other room being lazy and using a webcam.

 

I kind of felt a bit disappointed to see a great actress who I thought was awesome doing adverts for... an IT company?

 

As for bands "selling-out" by doing different styles and stuff, shhhh, that's not selling-out, that's just fans being pissy.

 

HEY @ReZourceman YOU MIGHT LIKE THIS THREAD BECAUSE I JUST MENTIONED YOU.

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I really don't see how it's selling out. People are complete idiots. OH NO THEY'VE PLAYED SOME MUSIC ON THE RADIO FUCKING SELL-OUTS!

 

John lewis asked them if they could use the song? Only an arrogant, pretentious dick would object - especially after seeing the advert. It's not even The Smiths anyway, it's a cover.

 

It's more exposure for the song/band. You could argue that they don't need it but you could also argue that they don't need to not let them. It's surely a compliment if someone wants to use your music on something.

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People gotta make money somehow.

 

I find it all a bit bullshit when people go on about selling out, they are still in a business, a thriving business with a lot of competition.

 

Boo freaking hoo.

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What does selling out even mean? Who exactly is it negatively affecting?

 

I think there's a difference between 'selling out'/making something shit and 'selling out'/keeping in character/with your brand/making something awesome. Like when Daft Punk did an advert for The GAP. Hysterical. The actual advert was entertaining. Loved it.

 

 

Juliette Lewis made that. And who the hell buys from Gap...

 

When So Me and Justice branded Coke bottles, no. Was crap. Disliked it. It was nothing. Weak. Boring. I didn't understand why it was there. Still, I wasn't in a huff about it. It did indicate to me that they are okay with cashing in (which in the case of So ME is okay since they are a design label).

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Juliette Lewis made that.

 

*Off topic* Juliette Lewis is craaaaaaaaaazy.

 

*On topic* I have no problem when bands 'sell out'. In a lot of cases it makes the music more awesome when it's being used for cool adverts and shizzle.

 

I can sort of understand musicians not wanting to lend their music to products/causes that they don't agree with though. I too would be pissed off if my music was being used to promote sweatshops or similar.

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You're a sell-out, Wesley.

 

What happened to you? You used to be cool.

 

And now I see you trying to start a serious discussion. Disgusting.

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Selling out is the process of hipsters getting annoyed that now other people have heard of their favourite thing and that somehow makes it less good.

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As others have said, how does this take away from the song? Florence + The Machine sang on the X Factor, but i still enjoy their music immensely. It's just morons who like to like obscure, slightly unknown music because they think it's cool to be different.

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Just to be clear, Morrissey could veto the use of this cover for this commercial - just as he has done numerous times over the last 20-odd years.

 

But this time he did not.

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I tend to have a problem with music being used in ads for pretty much the reason Yorke talks about here:

 

 

I'm not really against music being used in adverts as long as the artists know what they are doing and choose wisely. Some songs such as 'Wouldn't It Be Nice' are so ubiquitous that I forget which ads they have appeared in and thus the song still has my memory attached when I listen to it, so to speak.

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I havn't watched the advert yet but I heard about it at work. Someone said that it was up for most emotional ad of the year maybe? And I scoffed, proclaiming my love for the Google advert.

 

I should probably watch the ad before going further.

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The advert is amazing. I actually found it quite emotional the first time i saw it, but i'm a pussy. :p

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I don't buy in to this notion of selling out in today's disposable world. Songs, bands, solo artists seem to lack that longevity they once did and so if someone like the Smiths is given an opportunity to get out there and become "relevant" to new listeners then fair play to them. That's not to say that here isn't a lot of respect to be had when people reject offers on principal for something they believe in. Anyway I love he advert!

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Just thinking about the point @ipaul made (that was made by Thom THOMTHOMTOHM).

 

My favourite Joy Division song (and yours if you think about it) is Ceremony.

 

And I think that New Order's version appeared in an advert.

 

For something...

 

But I can't for the life of me remember what it was for.

 

I keep thinking it was maybe beer?

 

I don't know.

 

All I know is whenever I heard it I was suddenly disconnected, in the most brilliant way, from my own present senses and instead was transported into a mind-set so fantastic it made me want to smash my own face in with a spanner.

 

Maybe if an advert ruins a song for someone then the song just wasn't good enough in the first place.

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Just to be clear, Morrissey could veto the use of this cover for this commercial - just as he has done numerous times over the last 20-odd years.

 

But this time he did not.

 

He obviously shops at John Lewis and Waitrose.

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Just thinking about the point @ipaul made (that was made by Thom THOMTHOMTOHM).

 

My favourite Joy Division song (and yours if you think about it) is Ceremony.

 

And I think that New Order's version appeared in an advert.

 

 

My Hero:heart:

 

My favourite New Order song is Ceremony. It just sounds so beautiful. You can hear the words of Ian Curtis through Bernard Sumner. It's the perfect bridge between the two bands.

 

I agree with Thom Yorke on this one, I think. The music that you create is very special, and it would be a shame if a song like, for example, Ceremony is remembered purely for being in a car advert or something.

 

I don't think it automatically makes you a bad person or a bad music artist if somebody wants to use your song in an advert and you say yes. It shows that people admire your song in the first place to ask such a thing. Also, whether you say yes or no, people are going to criticise you for it anyway. They'll either criticise you for being a sell-out, or argue that you're over-protective of your work, or arrogant.

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I'd say it all depends on how you pull it off. Some commercials just double in greatness with the right use of famous people/songs/whatever, while others are just so blatant and poorly made that you shake your head in shame.

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Two Weeks by Grizzly Bear springs to mind.

 

But then gurls gotta get thur moneh.

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I don't really get how licensing/making money on music when you've made a career of making money on music is selling out, tbh. Besides I thought the whole point of making music was to sell-out stuff and make lots of money, no?

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I can't remember who said this, but:

 

"Everyone is selling themselves every day; it's just that some people are smart enough to be paid for it."

 

EDIT: I remember who said that: me, just now, in this post.

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USE REAL WORDS.

 

Wai?

 

Words are useless, especially sentences. They don't stand for anything - how could they explain how I feel?

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My god, people are making money from music now?

 

RUN, HAZEL, RUN! DON'T LOOK BACK, JUST RUN! RUUUuUuuuuUuUuUuUuUn!

 

Ultimately: who cares? Musicians aren't your best friend, they need to make ends meet some how.

 

As I understand it, Freddie Mercury met a lot of ends. He died happy.

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Ultimately: who cares? Musicians aren't your best friend, they need to make ends meet some how.

 

 

I'll preface what I'm about to say by stating that I know it's idealistic and is a little out of whack with how the world works.

 

But as musicians, should the number one consideration be how much money they make? I mean if someone is really struggling and they get offered money for an advert, then yeah I can understand it. I would like to think that for some musicians, they know they have enough money and that their main focus would be trying to attain a creative peak or further their artistic and cultural endeavours.

 

I don't like the idea that the thought process behind some of the music I like went along the lines of: "Here's hoping we make a shitload of money of this". It's much nicer to think this happened: "Here's hoping this song/album will be fucking awesome/our best yet". I understand the two are not mutually exclusive by any means, but to think the creative process involved all of the former sentiment and none of the latter is a bit sad and alienating.

 

Tangent over :heh:

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