This edition?s topic concentrates on the Japanese game charts, and in general, the battle between Xbox and GameCube in the land of the rising sun. Members of our forum answered the following question: ?With Nintendo clinching the top 3 and not an Xbox game in sight, has Nintendo won the Japanese battle against XBox??

Thank you to all the 23 participants: Chris_the_great, Link, Richardjoones, Qbas, Well_chuffed, pdhq64, King of the Swing, Athlon-pv, Lockey, James, MeatAgent, Mike, mattcube, mrtomb87, pohleonguk, 4-Q-2, spikeydude, Fierce_Link, Kingofunrealuk, Sip, Tetsuo (short, but fundamental intervention), Owario, and for the first time SSJ2_Young_Gohan.

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Chris_the_great: Xbox has not got the type of games Japan seems to love. I think like all things, it will have a small following but I doubt it will beat Nintendo in Japan. Xbox has done well in America and it's only slightly behind GameCube in Europe, its all about taste. The only thing that makes Xbox sell is that it can throw money at anything it wants and snap it up.

Link: In my opinion, there never was a battle between Xbox and GameCube, Nintendo have not done as well as hoped but have sold a lot more units and XBox has sold and appalling amount of consoles since launch. Overall Nintendo has won (in my opinion) Microsoft?s Xbox.
If you look at the Japenese charts you will see games like Gundam, Final Fantasy etc, these are the types of games the Japanese enjoy, the Xbox hasn?t got any and the GameCube has few and soon to have many. This is the reason Xbox wont sell in the east and the reason why GameCube and PS2 will crush Xbox in the land of the rising sun.

Richardjoones: Xbox has sold very few consoles in Japan, in my opinion this is because the one game that made the Xbox sell well in the US and reasonably in Europe was Halo:- A first person shooter and the Japanese don't like first person shooters much. Take a look at the line up of launch games of the Xbox and forget Halo and your not left with many good games at all.
That combined with the higher price of the Xbox, a controller not suited to Japanese hands and a console that is big when the Japanese are obsessed with small has lead to very bad sales. Also the Japanese are a lot more loyal to a brand than the Western consumer and so are less likely to change consoles.
Simply the GameCube has a far better line-up of good exclusive games, especially from the Japanese point of view.

Qbas: I think Xbox didn't have a choice in Japan, but I think MS's aim is to make their console be there and not make profit. MS needs more games that appeal to Japanese gamers because their games doesn't show much in sales. Nintendo will always be either number 1 or 2 in Japan well if you include GBA too to those sales.

Well_chuffed: To be honest with you, I could never see the Xbox doing well in Japan. The Japanese aren't likely to accept a games console that hasn't come from them, it's usually the same with games.
The Japanese seem to have become Playstation followers anyway, even the GameCube is struggling in comparison, though at least it doesn't have to compete with the previous generation consoles. Sales are slowly shifting, but I doubt it will make much of an impact in the long run. Those Japanese obviously don't know what they are missing!

Pdhq64: At the moment, Nintendo are beating Microsoft in Japan. If you look at the games, the Japanese prefer RPGs and weird (to us westerners) type of games. Microsoft don?t really have many of these games available to the Japanese market. Most games released on the Xbox are games which are styled to meet our needs. This is mainly because Microsoft is an American company, and Nintendo is Japanese.
Then we move onto hardware - the Japanese like small things, hence the GameCube being so small, and the Americans seem to think it's cool to have bigger stuff than everyone else. (Look at their cars!)

If Microsoft were to bring out a 'new style' Xbox, with games suited to Japanese taste, they might have more of a chance in Japan.

King of the Swing: Nintendo haven't won the Japanese Xbox battle. Some of you may have heard of Xbox live. That is the main fuel for the Xbox. Nintendo have shown little care for video gaming's on-line future. Microsoft have endless money. They can do things that no other company in the world can do. If something fails, Bill Gates just shoves another billion dollars into the equation.
Microsoft is American, Nintendo is Japanese. That makes a big difference. Microsoft have shown little care for the Japanese style of Role Playing Games and anime-based titles.
Xbox could strike at any moment. Just wait. And remember, Game Boy Advance is a hugely selling console, and Starfox Adventures is a killer app.

Athlon-pv: Nintendo will beat ANY platform hands down on content. The problem is that MS doesn?t play that way. There former business practises are known and feared (not saying that Nintendo hasn't been doing or did the same/alike thing(s)).
What they (MS) do currently is buying software houses. Bungie is a perfect example. Bungie used to be an excellent producer of games running on Mac as well as PC. They buy such companies to produce games that hit home in the American market.

Rare was sold, people scream, but what counts are the games for us consumers, as long as Nintendo (or any 3rd party)keeps producing games that are worthwhile then the X-box hasn?t got a hope in hell making it in Japan. I bet that even the American market can be made hell for MS if Nintendo keeps content good on it's platform.

Only thing X-box has over GameCube is the amount of titles slated or released for it. Quantity is something which is slowly getting better for people owning a GameCube.

Lockey: It is simple Xbox was made for Americans for a number of reasons. Japan likes small things like phones and GameCubes and in a America they like things big like portions of food, buildings and Xboxes. Xbox does not suit it small, dinky Japanese.
Also the games available are a big factor of why the Xbox is a flop in Japan. The main game Halo was perfect for Europe and America but in Japan they aren?t too fond of shoot em-ups this was proven with Perfect Dark on the N64. Or maybe it just wasn?t meant to be. Only time will tell...

James: I think that more people in Japan prefer Mario games and Nintendo considering that the great man himself is stationed there, you know who I am talking about. But the Xbox does not have the 'right' games. Maybe a few attractions but not as many as the GameCube. Personally I think yes, Nintendo has beaten X-Box down to the ground.

MeatAgent: I don't think that Microsoft are completely licked in Japan, but when you consider all the moves they have made so far, it's hard to see why they aren't beating GameCube already - a controller specially designed for the Japanese market, DOA3, the sexiest booth girls at all their exhibitions. However, I don't think that the acquisition of Rare will shift too many units in Japan.

But take into account all this, and the fact that Nintendo haven't really made too much effort in their homeland, save a few TV adverts, you have to wonder how long Nintendo will be in second place. I can't help but get the impression that Nintendo would rather push the GBA.

Neither unit will ever overtake PS2, even if they stopped making them tomorrow - the user base is just too big.

Mike: Nintendo hasn't won the battle in Japan - yet they're proving to their critics that they can survive even with the PS2 in first place. Nintendo needed to find a niche where they could distance their products from PS2 and Xbox, and they are making a significant success of the Japanese gaming market in this way. They have a long way to go before achieving mass popularity but they are doing their own thing in a way which no other developer could hope to do so. The Xbox is dead and buried in Japan even with Microsoft's lorry loads of cash but Nintendo are still staying afloat and are making a decent profit. The Gameboy Advance is fast becoming a licence to print money in the Far East and the GameCube is comfortable. Hats off to Nintendo!

Mattcube: I wouldn't call it a win for Nintendo. Sure Xbox hasn't been a success in Japan and GameCube has faired better but not by much. The ps2 still rules all and you see it in the statistics. Can anyone beat the might Sony? Well at the moment no.

Their gamble paid off, yet again Sony got into their next-gen console into market first and it has paid off. Its going to be difficult to break the cycle because although the later consoles are more powerful they way Sony have staggered their launches they are one step ahead. People want the newest thing and Playstation is now a rock steady brand.

The real question is who out of Nintendo and Microsoft will survive to fight another day. At the moment I don't have a clue. GameCube is doing better now but Xbox has the money and backing. Bill Gates wont give up so easily and I think everyone knew that the real power of Microsoft will be apparent with the launch of the Xbox2 - Microsoft are just dipping their toes in the market with the Xbox. This is going to be a war of attrition; Sony will win but I think its too close to call who will lose.

All we can do is wait and see.

Qbas: Well if you count both GBA and GC then Nintendo will have a change to topping PS2 in sales GBA and GC sales combined. GC is doing pretty good in overall.

Mrtomb87: Has Nintendo managed to beat the Xbox in Japan. Yes. With both the GameCube and the Game Boy Advance selling superior numbers of units to the Xbox it appears Nintendo have got it all wrapped up in Japan. Wrong! Why must Nintendo sit back and allow itself to always be second best in the home console wars. Just because the Playstation thrashed the N64 in the gaming market doesn't mean that this has to be repeated. The GBA has managed to outsell the PS2 so why can't the GameCube follow in its foot steps. If Nintendo?s upcoming announcement is as revolutionary as they claim this will be the first step towards Japanese domination but for me their next step must be online gaming. With the franchises that Nintendo own then a move in the upcoming months could mean success over the Xbox AND the PS2. Why not?

Pohleonguk: Has Nintendo won the battle? Well partially, so far it seems clear that the GameCube is the winner, but this will only stay like this if Nintendo can keep up the work and keep bringing out games for the next 2 years or so. The Xbox has failed to attract Japanese gamers because of the games. With games like Halo not appealing to them, if Microsoft wish to have success in Japan they will need to acquire developers willing to make new games which will quit the market. You could say Nintendo do have the advantage over Microsoft, with Nintendo having the more experience and Japan also being home turf. But this doesn't mean that the battle is won yet...

4-Q-2: For now Nintendo are safe in Japan, but Microsoft don?t seem to be in this for the small cash, and are willing to pour serious sums into buying the sort of stuff that appeals to the territory it is selling on.

I would say Nintendo's real battle on their own territory will happen in the next gen when MS has more knowledge of the market.
I think the main problem holding MS back if anything is the XBox seems to be a more westernised product in its design and content..

Qbas: I think why Xbox isn't doing so well in Japan is because it is foreign product and Japanese tend to buy products made from etc. Nintendo, Sega or Sony and besides MS lacks Japanese developers there. And in America Xbox is doing slightly better than GC but I?m not surprised because MS is an American company.

Spikeydude: I don't think it's possible for the GameCube to lose in Japan - it has great franchises which will always bring people in - Mario, Zelda etc. and while Nintendo won't win against Sony's massive user base I think that Microsoft should be seriously rethinking their plans - they can't defeat the giant behemoth that is PlayStation - they haven't even overtaken Nintendo...they will soon be making a decision whether to discontinue the billion dollar losing Xbox or just pour more money in.....and I think that they will stop making Xbox - to make the whole project worthwhile they will need to sell way more than PS2 but they won't be able to before the next generation of consoles appears. Nintendo are not going to go away - get out Microsoft.

Fierce_Link: Well, Zelda is the most anticipated game in Japan! So I don't think Nintendo will fail Japan. I think they have beaten the X BOX in Japan anyway because the X BOX has sold poorly since its launch and I don't think it can recover.

Kingofunrealuk: Well now that most of the most anticipated games for the GameCube have come out in Japan there is a problem really! Starfox Adventures didn't sell to well at all, Mario sold ok but the next few like Mario Party 4 and Zelda etc. not coming out quite soon what?s after that if Nintendo don't get a grip on the market then there in trouble in Japan. PSO Episodes I and II with the modem hasn't sold to well in Japan either what on earth got people to buy the console? Then again Western games have become more popular since the launch of the XBOX in Japan for example Halo, Jet Set Radio Future and Project Gotham Racing is Microsoft going to take hold of the Japanese market? NO! That?s because of Sony _ still Nintendo have to produce AAA games for Japan!

Qbas: Nintendo is always secretive about their games that is their tactic. So I think we will see some awesome games next year and as Miyamoto said in some article that next years games will "blow" this years game out of the wind. (Note from Gualtiero: He was referring to Zelda, of course?)

Sip: I don't think Nintendo beat the Xbox (yet). Two of those top three games are GBA games, so they're not in competition with the Xbox, which is a thing to consider. Another thing to consider is that Microsoft has loads of money, and it's strategy seems to just spread a lot of Xboxs through the world, mainly to create a large user- base.

There will be some exclusives on the Xbox that might do very well in Japan, and Rare could be able to do something good in Japan (seeing as how the only GC game in the Japanese top 30 is Star Fox Adventures - a Rare game). And then there are the rumours of Microsoft buying Capcom or other Japanese companies, which would be a move that would definitely make the Xbox more popular in Japan.

Despite the fact that no single Xbox game was even in the top-30 (was that the top-30 of one week?), I don't see Microsoft giving up.

Fierce_Link: But didn't Star Fox adventures sell well because of the Star Fox name? Wasn't it considered short by too many people?

Tetsuo: Quite frankly, yes.

Owario: With Nintendo being the main games company in Japan (I think) I don?t think they can lose, especially with games such as Zelda, Metroid and Mario Party 4 coming out. In my opinion Xbox cant win with its only really good game being Halo, and Japanese people not really liking First Person Shooters. Anyway, that?s what I have to say.

SSJ2_Young_Gohan: All I think is that Nintendo shouldn't have had sold Rare. Xbox might make an awesome come back with their new ammo. I'm talking about Perfect Dark, and Banjo and Kazooie. Though Banjo might be a little too childish for the Xbox, so they might not make that. (Correct me if I'm wrong...)
Well, that was the first time I've ever posted something onto a round table. I think it's fun.
Later guys!

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As you can see, the contributors had mixed ideas regarding this topic, but nonetheless it was very interesting to discuss. Make sure you participate in the next edition by visiting the forums, GameCube Discussion, and Board Roundtable #10. Have fun!